There is something I don't understand. Clipping is sound above the maximum
allowed sound. As the sound of a CD is stored on a CD, and the maximum amplitude sound that can be stored on a CD is obviously the maximum
allowed
intensity on a CD, how can there be clipping on a CD, ie the sound of the
CD
exceding the sound that can be stored on this CD. That seems strange to me.
I'll repeat what I sent to Peter.
You're thinking lossless compression here, 'cause you won't get a signal different from the original with lossless compression such as Monkeyaudio.
No, I'm speaking of the original CD, without any compression. Some users are telling that there is some clipping on the CD itself. I personnaly think that it's impossible, but wanted to know if I was missing something about it.
Regards,
--
Gabriel Bouvigne - France bouvigne@mp3-tech.org mobile phone: gsm@mp3-tech.org icq: 12138873
MP3' Tech: www.mp3-tech.org personal page: gabriel.mp3-tech.org
Gabriel Bouvigne wrote:
There is something I don't understand. Clipping is sound above the maximum
allowed sound. As the sound of a CD is stored on a CD, and the maximum amplitude sound that can be stored on a CD is obviously the maximum
allowed
intensity on a CD, how can there be clipping on a CD, ie the sound of the
CD
exceding the sound that can be stored on this CD. That seems strange to me.
I'll repeat what I sent to Peter.
You're thinking lossless compression here, 'cause you won't get a signal different from the original with lossless compression such as Monkeyaudio.
No, I'm speaking of the original CD, without any compression. Some users are telling that there is some clipping on the CD itself. I personnaly think that it's impossible, but wanted to know if I was missing something about it.
I already sent a reply for this question, but wanted to clarify something. I mentioned CD's that are compressed as well as amplified in the final mixing stage. The compression I'm referring to is increasing quiet passages to match the loudest passages. So that's how the peaks and lows disappear. I think all radio broadcasts are compressed like this. So if you're in a car, you don't have to turn up the volume in order to hear the quiet parts of a song, as it's all the same loudness. You can also get Winamp plug-ins that compress the audio on-the-fly, such as AudioStocker and RockSteady. However, most pure audiophiles detest such sound bastardization of course.
On Fri, 15 Dec 2000 05:18:31 -0600, David Shin wrote:
I already sent a reply for this question, but wanted to clarify something. I mentioned CD's that are compressed as well as amplified in the final mixing stage. The compression I'm referring to is increasing quiet passages to match the loudest passages. So that's how the peaks and lows disappear. I think all radio broadcasts are compressed like this. So if you're in a car, you don't have to turn up the volume in order to hear the quiet parts of a song, as it's all the same loudness. You can also get Winamp plug-ins that compress the audio on-the-fly, such as AudioStocker and RockSteady. However, most pure audiophiles detest such sound bastardization of course.
Radio stations further compress the already mastered material with multiband comppressors(www.prorec.com has good articles on that). Optimod for example is a five band compressor of this nature($12000). The main reason for pushing up the sound to their transmission limiters is NOT primarily because of dynamics. It plays a part of course, but the executives(never the guy actualy making the settings on the Optimod) demand loudness. I've never heard of anyone else wanting so much destruction of dynamics for loudness. The guy at one of the four most popular radio stations told me he'd made the compression 'nice' sounding and promptly got a call from the boss as to why they weren't as loud as the others any longer.
Audio amateurs and business professionals are executives in one skin.
Tony
On Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:50:39 +0100, Gabriel Bouvigne wrote:
You're thinking lossless compression here, 'cause you won't get a signal different from the original with lossless compression such as Monkeyaudio.
No, I'm speaking of the original CD, without any compression. Some users are telling that there is some clipping on the CD itself. I personnaly think that it's impossible, but wanted to know if I was missing something about it.
They're right unfortunatly. The RED BOOK standard does say, "No more than five clipped samples on the entire CD", but people avoid that by pulling down clipped material to -0.1 to -0.5 dB. Black Eyes Peas is a very bad example, where the album was clipped by at least 2 dB and then leveled down by 0.5 dB. If mr.joe consumer don't hear, the mastering engineer might do it.
The normal job of mastering engineers is to iron out any extremes and errors as well as making shure it doesn't sound too completly different to other records of the same genre. This is most evident if you simply apply an EQ of +6dB to the mids and turn it on and off a couple of time. Mastering engineers also compress the audio to optimize it. Unfirtunatly the clients want their material to be as loud as possible and those are usualy inept executives at record companies or the producers. These are people who believe they know what they're doing.
Well, they don't in many cases. It's down to personal preference in the end. If you still like listening to it, then it doesn't matter and that's the case with most people.
The extreme nature of the compression means that peaks are likely to pop up when lossy encoded material is played back again.
To me material that has been dynamically compressed too much sounds boring. The ear gets used to it, same as it gets used to too much treble boost and you yawn after a few minutes. That's why I only listen to Robbie Williams material occasionaly, 'cause that was killed by the mastering engineer. It might play loud on MTV but it fucking bores me after a while, and even though I like the songs, I turn 'em down after while. DOWN!
You might want to remember that a certain amount of compression in needed tough. Who wants siginificant dynamics in a club tune. Not too much any way. A rock song doesn't need too much dynamics anyway and distorted guitars usualy have almost none. Hey, it's why lots of people like live music too :). They compress stuff there too but only so it can be heard better.
Tony
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Anthony Airon Oetzmann -
David Shin -
Gabriel Bouvigne